Innocent question

[Steve Hayes]

Which one would you use, and why?

1. innocent until proved guilty

2. innocent until proven guilty


Which was the original usage?

[Hibou]

Post by Steve Hayes
Which one would you use, and why?
1. innocent until proved guilty
2. innocent until proven guilty

'Proven' - it slips more easily off the tongue. I think I'd also favour
'till'.

Post by Steve Hayes
Which was the original usage?

<https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=innocent+until+proven+guilty%2Cinnocent+until+proved+guilty%2Cinnocent+till+proven+guilty&year_start=1800&year_end=2019&corpus=en-2019&smoothing=3>

[Anton Shepelev]

Post by Hibou

Post by Steve Hayes
Which one would you use, and why?
1. innocent until proved guilty
2. innocent until proven guilty

'Proven' - it slips more easily off the tongue.

It is also /the/ grammrical variant, because `proven' above
is not a verb.

Post by Hibou
I think I'd also favour 'till'.

Probably, whereas in "Innocent until caught," `until' is
definitely better, and also a fun game:

<https://www.myabandonware.com/game/innocent-until-caught-1zi>

[Bertel Lund Hansen]

Post by Steve Hayes
Which one would you use, and why?
1. innocent until proved guilty
2. innocent until proven guilty

2. with no doubt.

Why? 1. is impossible. I suppose that 2. is what I have met before.

It may play a role that we in Danish also have an n-form of the past
participle of some verbs, and that form is often used in idiomatic
expressions. In some cases the standard form even has another meaning.

[Paul Carmichael]

Post by Steve Hayes
Which one would you use, and why?
1. innocent until proved guilty
2. innocent until proven guilty
Which was the original usage?

1 is the only one normally heard (it's a set phrase), but I don't see
anything wrong with 1.